• nsanity
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Topic: S.A.D sound driver problems

So I have built a SAD disk with DP_Base 8.12.5 and DP_Sound_A_wnt5_x86-32_1003, DP_Sound_B_wnt5_x86-32_1003 and I'm having a bit of a problem.

When applied to a fresh install of XP, the sound driver installs - but doesn't work until I remove the HD Audio driver (both Sigmatel HD Audio Codec and Realtek HD Audio - 2 machine types doing it) then re-add it via "scan for new hardware".

Any thoughts as to why? Or if i can script removing the driver (uninstall) then re-adding them?

  • OverFlow
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Re: S.A.D sound driver problems

XP Pro SP3 retail? 

R U using RVMI hfslip nLite? If you are not using a SP3 source are you at least using KB888111?
Please see "read before you post" linked in my signature to get some ideas about what we need in the way of details

IE I would not be able to reproduce your issue based on the minimum details provided in your post... TY for providing DriverPacks BASE and DriverPacks versions, and indicating that you're doing a SAD install, those details do help a lot.

If you could provide your setupapi.log that would be a HUGE help. Please either link to it on rapid share or whatever or paste it into multiple posts here. Don't bother with the setupapi log if you are not using SP3 or have not included KB888111 in your source, since HDA will not function/install if you do not have KB888111 included (SP3 includes KB888111) wink.

Looking foward to assisting you.


PS yes DEVCON can be scripted to install and uninstall devices big_smile.

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  • nsanity
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Re: S.A.D sound driver problems

Ahh ok.

Essentially what i'm doing is

Sysprepped image with only f6 mass storage applied (we only have intel to worry about), single boot then dump a local copy of S.A.D over the top for drivers. I tried to do the whole lot in OEMPNPDriversPath - ended up with Zero drivers.

Base image is a slipstreamed SP3 install, patched to the hilt (or wednesday last week).

here is the setupapi.log file - http://users.on.net/~randomtask/setupapi-tm6493.log

Test machines are a Dell D630 laptop and an Acer Travelmate 6493.

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Re: S.A.D sound driver problems

OEMPNPDriversPath has a limit of 4096 in normal windows installation, and half that in SysPrep. If you exceed a path length of 2048 in sysprep then either nothing is installed or only the first 2048, usually nothing wink.

I suggest you include chipset in  OEMPNPDriversPath, that may cure your issue.

Also I highly recomend you take a long hard look at OLSP (Off Line SysPrep by Galapo).

Let me know if the issue still persists after you add chipset to your base install.

alternately you could try running SAD twice... IE sometimes certain drivers will depend on others, hda depends on hdabus (hdabus=KB888111), hdabus depends on pcibus, no hdabus then no hda this would require two / three passes wink Test: run SAD reboot run SAD agian... does it work now?

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  • nsanity
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Re: S.A.D sound driver problems

OverFlow wrote:

OEMPNPDriversPath has a limit of 4096 in normal windows installation, and half that in SysPrep. If you exceed a path length of 2048 in sysprep then either nothing is installed or only the first 2048, usually nothing wink.

I suggest you include chipset in  OEMPNPDriversPath, that may cure your issue.

What about using the reg entry? HKLM\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\DevicePath

My understanding was you were allowed 64,000 there? (I tried both)

OverFlow wrote:

Also I highly recomend you take a long hard look at OLSP (Off Line SysPrep by Galapo).

I looked at that, I couldn't really find much in the way of a tutorial (or even a base idea). Is the idea you build an image to be sysprepped, then shutdown, boot BartPE with OLSP and do it that way?  Any further info on a good starting point with OLSP would be nice.

OverFlow wrote:

alternately you could try running SAD twice... IE sometimes certain drivers will depend on others, hda depends on hdabus (hdabus=KB888111), hdabus depends on pcibus, no hdabus then no hda this would require two / three passes wink Test: run SAD reboot run SAD agian... does it work now?

Will test this before doing below.

OverFlow wrote:

Let me know if the issue still persists after you add chipset to your base install.

Will try doing this next run (S.A.D is missing a few things from our images, trying to add them via OEMPNPDriversPath - if that works, then I'll try add chipset).

Thanks for the help.

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Re: S.A.D sound driver problems

Galapo has a link to his main forum from here at DriverPacks in this (universal imaging) forum... His main support is done over at 911 http://www.911cd.net/forums//index.php?showtopic=22064
(it is stickied right above your post LOL)

My impression was the limit of a DevicePath reg entry was the limit of any single reg entry one megabyte?
We have been having an issue with no drivers being installed when too many 3rd party DriverPack were used...
Can you show me where you found it documented that the devpath limit was 64k? that would really help us!

Thanks for the feedback, looking forward to more

Jeff

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  • nsanity
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Re: S.A.D sound driver problems

OverFlow wrote:

My impression was the limit of a DevicePath reg entry was the limit of any single reg entry one megabyte?
We have been having an issue with no drivers being installed when too many 3rd party DriverPack were used...
Can you show me where you found it documented that the devpath limit was 64k? that would really help us!

Source was here - http://blog.remyservices.net/2007/09/28 … -image-pc/

further reading tells me that its not quite that long...

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/256986

The following table lists the data types that are currently defined and that are used by Windows. The maximum size of a value name is as follows:

    * Windows Server 2003, Windows XP, and Windows Vista: 16,383 characters
    * Windows 2000: 260 ANSI characters or 16,383 Unicode characters
    * Windows Millennium Edition/Windows 98/Windows 95: 255 characters

Long values (more than 2,048 bytes) must be stored as files with the file names stored in the registry. This helps the registry perform efficiently. The maximum size of a value is as follows:

    * Windows NT 4.0/Windows 2000/Windows XP/Windows Server 2003/Windows Vista: Available memory
    * Windows Millennium Edition/Windows 98/Windows 95: 16,300 bytes

Note There is a 64K limit for the total size of all values of a key.

Either way its more than 4096/2048. - my programmer friend tells me its 16k, unlimited if you point to a file somewhere (although i am unsure if you can do that for this particular key).

I also found these tools helpful - http://technet.microsoft.com/en-au/maga … light.aspx - specifically PNPPath.vbs (which can apply both the registry and an .inf file).

OverFlow wrote:

Galapo has a link to his main forum from here at DriverPacks in this (universal imaging) forum... His main support is done over at 911 http://www.911cd.net/forums//index.php?showtopic=22064

Thanks, will look into this

Last edited by nsanity (2010-03-22 12:06:07)

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Re: S.A.D sound driver problems

OverFlow wrote:

alternately you could try running SAD twice... IE sometimes certain drivers will depend on others, hda depends on hdabus (hdabus=KB888111), hdabus depends on pcibus, no hdabus then no hda this would require two / three passes wink Test: run SAD reboot run SAD agian... does it work now?

Twice = no go. (specifically run SAD, reboot, run SAD again).

Will try adding chipset to OEMPNPDriversPath, then reimaging.

Uninstall, Scan and then Windows "automagics" it works fine however (no online connectivity, i'd assume its pulling it from the driver cache after SAD puts it there), no reboot required.

http://users.on.net/~randomtask/DPsFnshr-tm6493-2.log
http://users.on.net/~randomtask/DPINST-tm6493-2.LOG
http://users.on.net/~randomtask/setupapi-tm6493-2.log

*edit*

Same again with OEMPNPDrivers for Chipset.

The driver works - I just think its installing wrong or something.

Last edited by nsanity (2010-03-22 14:44:00)

  • OverFlow
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Re: S.A.D sound driver problems

I have seen issues with DPInst.exe where it does not behave the same as setup.exe IDK why...
Perhaps a new version of DPInst will be released in the future.

You can still use a script with devcon to remove and reinstall a particular device smile.

the answer to why it failed is / will be contained in setupapi.log... I haven't had a chance to review the one you submitted yet.

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  • nsanity
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Re: S.A.D sound driver problems

Im going to try nightlies of the affected drivers (as well as DP_Base) as i have other wierd issues on my 2 test platforms;

1. Dell D630 Intel 965 Express driver installs, but leaves a second entry under display adapters - "Update Driver automagically" fixes this.
2. Acer TM6493 laptop has an "!" on its Built-in IR Port.

It also might sort my sound problems out (fingers crossed), I also have a problem with Intel Mass Storage not working right (BSOD on boot in AHCI mode) - trying DriverPack MS Nightly.

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Re: S.A.D sound driver problems

only use the nightly mass with the nightly BASE wink otherwise your source WILL be hosed

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Re: S.A.D sound driver problems

You might try using Vernalex Sysprep Driver scanner. Its much easier to use than trying to populate the OemPnPDriversPath by hand.
http://www.vernalex.com/tools/spdrvscn/index.shtml

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Re: S.A.D sound driver problems

Hmm... Long values (more than 2,048 bytes) must be stored as files with the file names stored in the registry.

Can't find any documentation on this... but it just may be the solution I have been searching for... the 16k limit would fit with the issues reported and explain a lot of the problems we have been having with too many tpdps being added... We suspected we had hit some sort of limit but most documentation led us/me to belive the cap was higher than 16k. Any clues as to how to implement pointing to a file and what the format of the file would be? (A binary format I must assume, but that is not specific enough to generate one, nor specificaly how to indicate it in the registry. wink) Typical MS merry go round it documented somwhere but good luck finding it (i thought bing was supposed to be the cure for that wink) I've tried every keyword search i can think of... with three different search engines and the built in MS search. sad I jsut need to figure out what the correct question is LOL

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Re: S.A.D sound driver problems

http://pubs.logicalexpressions.com/Pub0 … asp?ID=361
16k limit for 95/98/me
64k limit for 2k and above

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Re: S.A.D sound driver problems

if i can figure out how to get the key to point to a file then teh limit becomes available RAM... that cures all our problems... i just need the documentation to implement it... still searching (in vain?)

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  • nsanity
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Re: S.A.D sound driver problems

going back to my original problem (namely having to remove and readd the sound driver)

Is this likely to be a problem with SAD or the driver pack itself? I have a work around, but I'd prefer that i didn't have to (because scripting a reboot after the "automagic" driver install after a devcon rescan is a pita).

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Re: S.A.D sound driver problems

We will probably have to wait for an updated driver...
My best guess it that there is a bug in the sound driver that only appears with dpinst.exe and not with setup.exe.

Bigfoot made a suggestion in post 12...
you could use Vernalex Sysprep Driver scanner to add it to the sysprep OemPnPDriversPath and see if that works

if you have time check to see if there is a newer driver for that device... If so we can update the pack and see if that fixes it!
be sure to test it and make sure it works or no sense in adding it to the pack wink

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  • nsanity
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Re: S.A.D sound driver problems

OverFlow wrote:

if you have time check to see if there is a newer driver for that device... If so we can update the pack and see if that fixes it!
be sure to test it and make sure it works or no sense in adding it to the pack wink

its 2 different hardware devices though. Sigmatel and Realtek HD Audio. I wonder if anyone else is able to test/replicate hmm

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Re: S.A.D sound driver problems

That is a big problem for us...
We don't have a secret lab with every known hardware device at our finger tips
- We have been hoping someone would donate one but it hasn't happend yet. LOL
We rely on our highly dedicated testing team for that but even so it is only a few dozen guys with machines they can blow up when needed.
(maybe there is a hundred, but never all active at the same time)
Our most important team member is you, the one guy who can first expose a rare issue and then prove a fix.
That is what makes DriverPacks so solid, yesterday we were 99.8 percent success now we are approaching 99.9% 
It's guys like you who make DriverPacks better, and earns you the hard sought "DriverPacks team member of the day" award.
It may be Nsane but it make sense too wink

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